Chickens

[Anataq]

We are thinking about raising chickens at our homestead for eggs and milk. We are concerned about preditors, primarily fox and bear, what do you recomend? We have been told that for the cold weather the Black Austrolops is a good breed, and the Buff Orphington as well for cold weather laying. Any ideas? There are a lot of brown bear in our area, course there are a lot of every other preditor as well.

-Anataq

[Freeholdfarm]

Actually, look up Sandhill Preservation Center on-line, and find the Chantecler chickens. They were developed in Canada, and from the sounds of them, are better suited to cold weather than any other breed of chicken.

However, ducks and geese are far better suited for extreme cold than any chicken breed, and some duck breeds are better layers than any breed of chickens, also. Duck eggs are just as good as chicken eggs, if they aren't dabbling in a pond. When we had poultry in Tok, we talked to the extension agent in Fairbanks, and he told us that geese can handle down to a hundred degrees below zero! It can get almost that cold in the Interior -- I've seen minus eighty-two degrees.

Kathleen

[Jenny]

I forgot you said you lived in Tok. Boy, it does get much colder up there than at our homestead, although we have had many spells of 35-45 below zero for weeks. When it warms up to zero, it sort of feels like a heat wave, doesn't it? ;D Chuck and I are wanting to get poultry again when we get back to the homestead. My sister in TX said ducks have to be able to splash around year round. Without electricity, that won't happen at our place. But it sounds like that's not really true.

For those hardy ducks, chickens and geese you mentioned, what do you feed them during the winter? We had several different kinds of chickens. Our least favorite were the Rhode Island Reds. They were tough, but also ate too much compared to what they produced in terms of eggs and meat. Just too pushy and aggressive. Had to lock 'em up just to let the others eat when we tossed out feed. We loved having chickens, but we hated having to fly out a plane load of grain to get them through the winter. We had some Buff Orpingtons and Barred Rocks. Both had great personalities, and were pretty efficient, but didn't do very good in the winter. Our banty hen ( the only one the dog didn't eat ) was wonderful. She consistently laid eggs, and was broody.

What we'd like when we go back are good hardy chickens/ducks/geese/whatever, and something that will be broody. We'll have to thin the flock for winter because it just is not cost effective to fly out so much food. But we don't want to be buying lots of birds every spring, either. Want to keep going with a few good broody hens. Any suggestions for hardy, broody breeds?

Regarding predators: We have lots of black bears, brown bears, marten, wolves and wolverines, and occasional lynx. We have a very strong house for the chickens, so we've never had problems with those animals. They sort of skirt the edges. Our animal houses are close to our dog lot. All that isn't too far from our house. Other outbuildings (caches, storage sheds and outhouse) are around the edges. Guess the predators are too claustrophobic for that setup. Our biggest problems have come from owls and falcons. Eagles constantly landed in the tops of tall trees to watch, but they never ventured down. Once a falcon chased our banty rooster, "Shorty", under our house. Chuck chased him off with a broom. The feathers were sure flying, but Shorty survived ;D I hear about lots of folks using a "tractor" for chickens. We love the idea, but I think it would have to be too heavy for us to move around since it would have to be relatively bear and falcon proof. I think they're better off free ranging. They're alert little things and always signal the others when they sense danger. The goats and chickens worked together on guard duty and learned to pay attention to each other. When they free range, they usually get to safety pretty fast. OK, enough questions and comments for now.

Jenny
Alaska HOMESTEADING Journal

[Freeholdfarm]

Ducks and geese only need enough water to wash their faces off while they are eating -- otherwise, they can choke on dry feed. In the winter, we used a flat black rubber feed pan for poultry water, because you can break the ice out of it by smashing it against a tree or something. There were icecicles all over the inside of the poultry pen, from the ducks and geese washing their heads and then shaking the water off! The only problem we had was one morning I went out and found one of the geese frozen into the water pan. He wasn't too thrilled about having to come in the house to thaw out!

As far as feed, that's a hard question for any poultry. Geese are easier than ducks and chickens as they are grazers, and even in the winter they can eat fine leafy hay with just a little grain. We fed all our kitchen scraps to the poultry, and you can also feed surplus milk to them for extra protein. Sprouted grains or seeds would be excellent. You could feed dry fish, but it would affect the flavor of the eggs. You might check and see what you can grow in your garden that would work for winter feed. Things like cabbages, mangel beets, carrots, and so on will feed the goats (and, minced fine, the poultry could eat a little). Will sunflowers mature a seed crop where your homestead is? Flax? Barley or oats? You wouldn't need a very large patch of any of these to feed a small flock (but you might have trouble keeping the moose out of them!).

For predators, you need a couple of good dogs. Livestock guardian dogs would work well, or you might consider something like old-fashioned farm collies (English Shepherds, if not show bred, are a good example of the type). Both will protect your poultry from feathered predators, believe it or not (at least, once they get the idea). One of the ladies on the American Working Farmcollie Association yahoogroups list was just telling us about two of the puppies she's bred, who have each saved the life of a three-year-old child, so with small children, that might be something to consider, too. There's an AWFA website, which has lots of information, if you are interested. It's at www.geocities.com/farmcollie1/assn.html and the yahoo list is at groups.yahoo.com/group/AWFA/?yguid=109437082

Dogs do well with goat milk in their diet, too, by the way!

Kathleen

[Freeholdfarm]

I forgot -- hardy broody breeds.

Most geese will go broody. Maybe one of the quieter breeds would attract less attention from predators, though geese are also good watchdogs. They are very strong, though, and can be dangerous to small children (one or two of those farm collies would help, here, also).

If I was going to have ducks in Alaska, I would probably choose Silver Appleyards. They are one of the larger breeds, large enough to make a good meat carcass, but they are also as good layers as most chicken breeds, and they will go broody. For chickens, the only hens I've ever had go broody were Ameraucana's. We had two in Tok, who hatched out about thirteen chicks between them, somewhere out in the woods. They wouldn't stay in the yard, and something got them, probably a fox. There are several breeds that are good layers and will sometimes go broody, but Ameraucanas are pretty reliable about it, and are also decent layers. Most of the really reliable broodies aren't very good layers, and vice versa. Muscovy ducks are supposed to be very reliable mothers, but I don't know if they are as hardy in Alaska as the other duck breeds, since they originated in the tropics. They don't have as much fat as the other ducks, and they have those partly bare heads. They are supposed to be excellent eating, though. Someday I'd like to have some, but we don't have enough room here for too many different types of animals.

Kathleen

[Terri]

HI!

I am a newbie to this board, and I have always wondered: How do you house your chickens in Alaska?

Do you keep them with other livestock, so that the body heat of the cattle (or whatever) protects them from frostbite? Do you provide them with artificial light to keep them laying?

Inquiring minds have (always) wanted to know! ;D

And, oh, yes. I live in KAnsas.

[Chuck]

Hi Terri,

This is Jenny posting as Chuck. Welcome to the forum. Please make yourself at home and feel free to jump right in. Chuck will post more later on this, I'm sure. I'm getting ready to go to work right now so only have a minute. Our old chicken house was converted to a storage building before we left. When we go back, we'll do some things differently. We built one little house for our goats and chickens. The outside walls and "attic" are insulated. We built a thin, uninsulated wall between the chickens and goats. One long nest box for the hens. No lighting, but it would be nice to have some for the chickens. When we get our windmill put up, and if we get enough wind, we may wire some lights for them.
We've thought about building something for all the animals, including a milking room. We'd sort of build it around a woodstove area that would be walled off from them, but that could still warm things up a bit. It would be larger. Since Chuck mills all of the lumber we use, and the good stuff is for projects we want to look nicer, we'll have to wait until we get enough "extra" for that.

Just a thought. If anyone who's lived in AK wants to tell us how you've worked it out, let all of us "inquiring minds" know.

Jenny

[Jenny]

Thanks for all the tips and suggestions on poultry. Certainly gives us more to think about before we start building up our new flock when we get back. Does sound encouraging.

Thanks again,

Jenny
Alaska HOMESTEADING Journal

[Freeholdfarm]

Well, where we lived in Tok is one of the three coldest inhabited spots on the whole continent, so I guess what worked there ought to work anywhere!

We had a 12'x16' shed, insulated. There was a small pen for two milk goats, a pen for the poultry along one long side, opposite the door, and four rabbit cages hung on the short wall next to the door and opposite the goat pen. The rabbit cages extended over the poultry pen. We kept the buck in a sort of 'dog house' arrangement, which actually didn't work too well. Buck goats pee all over themselves during the breeding season, which means they are frequently wet, and being wet when it's pushing seventy below is a very bad thing. In spite of having a nice little house and plenty of bedding, he ended up freezing. The chickens had some trouble with frozen combs, and a few lost toes, but we had at least a few eggs all winter (usually frozen by the time we collected them, but better than no eggs). The ducks and geese did just fine.

One couple we knew had a little chicken house with just hens and a few ducks in it. It was *just* big enough for the number of birds they had, and had a fairly low ceiling. They also built a shelf for the hens to get up on, that was sort of a loft over half the floor space. It was insulated, but not heated except by body heat.

Another couple we knew had built their little barn mostly underground. It stuck up a couple of feet out of the ground, and had some short windows on the south side. The roof was covered with sod. I don't think they insulated it, but because it was underground it didn't freeze inside. They kept a couple of milk goats and a dozen or so hens in there.

Here in Oregon, the east side that's mostly high desert and gets a little chilly in the winter, my hens are wintering just fine in a chicken tractor. It's mostly covered with a tarp, but the tarp is getting pretty frayed-- I'll have to replace it when things that out a little here. Right now I can't open the door, because it's frozen down (we've had freeze-thaw cycles, and the mud pushed up around the bottom of the door and then froze again), so I'm thankful that the tarp can be pushed aside to fill the feeder and water pan. But I can't reach in to collect eggs. Basically all the chicken tractor does is keep the wind and rain/snow off the birds, and they seem to be doing fine. No frozen combs that I can see.

Kathleen

[smwon]

I had thought about underground housing for my animals also. I think that would be good no matter where you lived. I am glad to hear that there are those that have figured out how to keep animals all winter up there. Thanks for the information.

Linda

[sundew]

I'm thinking of chickens again-something came and took all of them one afternoon with no feathers left behind so I quit.
Anyone use cayenne pepper in feed in winter to warm the chickens? I have always done this so not sure if it really made a difference. Sounds like ya'll get eggs in winter anyway.
I also like the underground housing idea. Where I am, it doesn't get really cold, yet would be easier keeping racoons, coyote's out at night.

[Washkeeton]

Hi Anataq. Nice to see a friend here. You will be south of me there by you should have no problems keeping chickens. I have mine in a 6x15 dog run for the time being. There is a tarp around it to protect from the wind. I am still getting eggs but not daily. I have the golden comets and buffs. I like the golden comets because they have been the ones to lay through out the winter, and they have been the ones to be able to handle the cold well, and their eggs are twice the size of the buffs. They are in with the turkeys and they are protected by my turkeys. I started building an insulated chicken coop and planed to move them over and for the winter I will run temporary light. They are suppose to have 16 or so hours of light to keep laying.

By the way I hope you dont really want to milk them. lol

[kasilofhome]

I no Santa got what ever chickens "he" could get for are son -- It was all that he wanted this past year. he's good at that his christmas list is always just for one item. when he was 4 he just had to have a watermelon. He got it.

Well we went on tradio and got these hens that did not lay any more and the people couldnt eat what they raised. well 11 days later and we have been getting an egg a day from at least 9 out of 10.

They live in an over grown dog shed and free range all day. We provide fresh warm water every 4 hours durring the hours of 6am to 9pm most mornings there is some ice in the coffee can waterer

They eat pellets and corn and all the outdated can goods left from bulk buying over kills. where i work I had access to can good at a great discount so they have grown to like canned beans and veg. that only i like.

The chickens have been such a great thing that we have a box of 2weekers and a few we hatched ourselves ( a few roosters came with the deal) - ones left. The boy shot and aided in cleaning one of them so he understands the chickens while fun and here for us to care for and put to good use.

This Friday a box of 50 will arrive. The postmaster has been quite surprized to be getting chickens so early. I just wanted to get my order done with before the airline trouble in March.

Ya may want to place your order NOW...
kasilof

[Freeholdfarm]

What airline trouble in March? I am supposed to have ducklings and goslings coming from SandHill Preservation Center in April.

Kathleen

[smwon]

Washkeeton said:

Hi Anataq... By the way I hope you dont really want to milk them. lol

LOL, I didn't catch that Wash, until you posted that... how funny!